2011 Camelot residential refrigerator install questions…discussion.

[Brad Loehr]

I am looking at installing a Samsung RF18 in my coach and have downloaded all the information and researched all the forums.  There is alot of great information.  Thanks everyone for sharing.

I do have questions/concerns about my height.  Here is the dimensions from Samsung:

Product Dimensions with Hinges, Handles and Door	32 1/8" W x 70 H x 28 1/8" D

Net Height with Hinge	70"
Net Height without Hinge	68 7/8"

In my 2005 HR Endeavor if I lower the fridge floor and make it with 1/2 plywood and add 1/2 clearance for the furnace top (Min clearance from Attwood) I will gain a max of 3 3/4 inches.  My Norcold cut out is 64 3/4"and I can get around 1 1/4" more if I cut out the top part of the fridge cabinet and save the space for my 3/4" deep roof LED light near the swing area of the doors.  This gets me 68 3/4"clearance which is not enough...

What have people done to roof LED light fixture to recess it flush so I can get the additional clearance.  If I get this flush mount so the Samsung french door will clear I can get a full 69.5 inches of height. Which is shy by 1/2"...

Can I remove the adjusters on the bottom to gain more clearance?

 

 

[jacwjames]

I know that my local Lowes usually has a RF18 on display, suggest you go measure the height of the door as it swings out.  You might go and measure.

 

In my case the furnace was elevated 1  5/8" above the floor, this was in order to run a propane line underneath for the fridge.  No fridge no propane needed so I was able to lower the furnace.  Still a very tight fir, my Windsor has the lower ceiling height.  I ended up using heavy conduit strut material and made two legs that the fridge rests on and left it open for air flow. 

I did have to cut/drill new intake and exhaust holes for furnace, which was the most intimidating part of the job.  To accomplish this I took the cover plate form the furnace pipe that had 4 holes in the corners, this gave me the location of the existing holed.  Took a 3/4" piece of wood to use as a template, mounted the plate and traced the hole, took the plate off and measured down 1 5/8"  to locate center of new holed.  Used a hole saw and cut new holes the correct size.  Drill the 4 holes used to mount the cover plate all the way through with a small bit and then fastened the template to the side of the coach.  Then used the hole saw to drill through the side of the coach.  This left me with two 1/2 moon pieces that I then glued to fill in the upper part of the old holes.  In the end I had two holes that the furnace mated to when I mounted it on the floor. 

When I removed the Norcold refrigerator they used some polished aluminum to make a heat diverter at the top.  I cut a piece out to that and used the template to cut new holes through it and then used the original chrome comvert plate over that.  Can't really tell the exhaust had been modified. 

[Ron Shantos]

What it the best way to physically secure/anchor the residential replacement?  Typically the residential refrigerators are going to have rollers. 

Getting the old Dometic out thur the Emergency Exit Window in our 2008 Contessa worked very well.  Thankfully-----

Now to get the new residential secured in the cabinet.  Appreciate input and experiences.

Ron 

[Tom Cherry]

43 minutes ago, Ron Shantos said:

What it the best way to physically secure/anchor the residential replacement?  Typically the residential refrigerators are going to have rollers. 

Getting the old Dometic out thur the Emergency Exit Window in our 2008 Contessa worked very well.  Thankfully-----

Now to get the new residential secured in the cabinet.  Appreciate input and experiences.

Ron 

Ron that has been posted many times....the answer is....WHATEVER WORKS BEST.

• Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES do you DRILL or DRIVE screws into the cabinet or the outside of the Samsung....or any RES REFER.  Folks have done that.  Hit refrigerant lines or circuits or heaters. NOT A PRETTY SITE.
• The trick is use DOUBLE STICK TAPE.  Use the 3M VHB (Very High Bond) - CLEAR. You can use the Black...which is Auto Emblem kind.  HOWEVER, if you pull the 3M specs...the clear has more bonding or holding power....some 30%.  There are Standardized PEEL and SHEAR tests.  SO, buy the clear.  Amazon has different widths and lengths.
• NEXT....the REAR is easy.  You can BLOCK the refrigerator with a simple "2X4".  BUT BE AWARE.  If you have a SHELF like many do....which has to be removed....Take ti out all the way to the back.  OTHERWISE...it blocks the air flow.  Mine wasn't and I had to use a hole sway and VENTILATE IT.  Works great...even in HOT weather.
• UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES...do you insulate or put any insulation around the RES REFER.  You insulate and block off a ROOF VENT...or if you have TWO SIDE VENTS (outside), you have to insulate the panels or covers.  You buy Garage Door panel foam.  Cut and fit and then use the 3M tape to bond and form inserts.  Then a layer of insulation on the back.  Cover the entire back side with FOIL HVAC Tape.  Leave clearances for the latches. If you vents have a louver or vent in the frame....gotta do the same.  FILL with a fabricated foam filler.  COVER the backside.  YOU MUST have the VENTS insulated with the same or close R-Value as the back or side walls of the surrounding area.
• NOW....the tricky part....what prevents it from GOING or walking OUT.  TWO WAYS...  First...if you can screw into the SHEET METAL around the back side....then screw into the sheet metal....not the cabinet.  Attach brackets to a 2X 4 Blocking....that keeps it from moving forward (falling out) or backwards....the 2X4 acts as a brace or blocker. NOW...read on
• Folks have fabricated all sorts of brackets...  MINE IS SIMPLE....to ME....  FIRST... about a foot from where the rear....  or a FOOT towards the FRONT...  Install TWO vertical pieces of wood.  Think 1X2 of 1/12 X 2. Some call these studs or perlines or "framing" like you use on a block wall when you want to panel over it.
• These two pieces should be about 15 - 18" long.  You screw them to the INTERIOR Side walls.  They can NOT stick out they should be maybe 3/4 -1" out or protruding.  These will be braces or stop for the side.  You install them so that there is maybe 6" above the TOP of the refrigerator and a foot or so below.
• NOW>>>the Narrative gets tricky.  You need a piece of 2X2 that will barely fit between the side walls.  That piece will lay ON TOP of the Refrigerator.  It so, when the refrigerator is installed and positioned....The piece of wood is on the TOP of the refrigerator....and the ends of it are BEHIND or on the BACK SIDE.  You are going to SECURE IT TO THE TOP....so when it is secured.....the two perlines or vertical strips are to the FRONT....so the refrigerator will NOT MOVE FORWARD.
• NOW....you have the concept.  HOW YOU GONNA SECURE.  You need some Aluminum or some SS (Bent) angle.  I had some bent or preformed SS angle....actually was a large plate.  Maybe 14 or 16 gauge.  You need two pieces.  The side turned up can NOT or should not be more than say 1 1/2" or however HIGH the cross brace (laying on top) is.  The width is maybe 6 - 8"...  The bottom side needs to be at LEAST 4" and 6" is better.  You drill TWO holes so you can drive two screws....in each brace or bracket into the wood.  SO...if you put the braces or bracket on top of the Refrigerator....you will screw them into the wood.  The wood brace can NOT move forward.  NOW you have that dry fitted.  Pull out the wood screws.  THEN on the BOTTOM (the 4 - 6" X 6 - 8" wide) piece...that is flat on the roof....you are gonna COVER IT WITH double stick 3M tape.
• THEN....you clean the top of the Refrigertor and the bottom of the plate or bracket with Acetone.  Put the tape on the bracket....or if you DRAW or Mark the top...put the tape down on the top.  Once you AFIX or double stick these plates or brackets in place.....the bottom is Laminated to the TOP of the Refrigerator.....then you put the screws back in.  BINGO...it ain't going anywhere.  NOW....mine did have the TOP SIDE VENT.  If yours has the ROOF...you will have to do something like that  on the back.  SOME folks have a bracket inside and on TOP of the refrigerator...that they can screw in place....and BLOCK the front from moving forward.

That's it...

[jacwjames]

On 7/3/2024 at 12:10 AM, Brad Loehr said:

 

I used conduit strut material to make two supports, one on either side of the furnace.  Only issue there was the wheels in the back of the fridge were wider then in the front, so I made sure the rear wheel tracked with the strut and the front was narrow.   The rear wheel is on the strut as I push the fridge back into position. 

When I modified my cabinet I beefed up the bottom on either side by attaching/gluing another piece on the back side.  On the front there were leveling pads on either side, I removed these and used the mount as support for the front. When I had the refrigerator set in place centered I took have L bracket and measured/cut so that I could mount under the leveling support and drilled a hole for the support pad to go in, I actually just used the pad to secure the fridge on the bottom. 

Then on the top I did what Tom C described.  I used aluminum angle ~10" long.  Predrilled holes to mount it to the face of the cabinet and painted them black on the visible surfaces..  I marked where they would go and then used HD 3M double sided tape on the aluminum angle, stuck them to the side of the fridge and the used screws to secure to the wood.  On the screws I made sure to start them so it would push the angle in toward the fridge.  

I've driven ~20K miles since the install across ~20 states with pretty rough roads and never had a problem with the fridge moving. 

[birdshill123]

On our Dynasty the driver side emergency window can be removed easily.  First remove the valence. On the outside the windows sits in a female rail. Like an awning rail

 At either end there is a small Robertson sheet metal screw. Remove both. Open the emergency latch and the window slides out.

[Ron Shantos]

I am in the final stage of readiness to install the new residential refrigerator.  It has to come in the EMERGENCY EXIT window on the driver side.  I have the desk which I have built an extended top to support the refrigerator coming thru that window.

HOW FAR CAN THAT WINDOW be opened up???   Any danger of it coming OUT OF THE TRACK??

Appreciate and input.

 

 

[Rocketman3]

Ron,

I can’t help much on the size of the window… we brought our in through the front door. Took out front chairs, and opened ft door wide open, put painters tape on metal door frame. Then took off doors to fridge. Had the two burly delivery guys lift it in (tipped them well!). 

To fasten mine down…

had to move the shelf lower - shored it up well. Then through the metal tray in the back (bottom) - drilled through that and used a bolt that goes through the shelf - so it’s bolted to the shelf. Also have 3 or 4 more screws going down through that metal tray too. On the side of the fridge that goes towards the front of the rig - added a 1x4 board (with carpet)along the side, so the fridge slides in and rests on that board. This way there is no side to side movement during a quick stop - because the fridge is already against the cabinet on that side.  Also added a board on the top back to help prevent the fridge from “tipping out”.

So far 2-1/2 years of full-time usage,  including two trips to Baja and one trip to Alaska, and it has not moved at all.

Good Luck!

[Tom Cherry]

EVERY MH is DIFFERENT.

MOST will remove the window (the ENTIRE FRAME) and use a window.  Probably 50% or more of our members did that.  Dealers will ALWAYS pull the window….after removing the Blind/Valance assembly.  That is EASY.  Many YouTubes on how to pull and reinatall.  These are mainly for when you disassemble the windows for moisture and fog and such removal…. BUT…concept is same.  Pull the window…..put aside…..take out the beast….bring in new…reinstall.  Double stick tape and caulk.

WHY…..easier….

NOW, many have used the front door.  More than a few regretted it.  They couldn’t or messed up the entire seat removal….and reinstall or didn’t do it.

Dashes are the number one collateral damage….big time.  One of the boxes (refrigerator) gets stuck…and the “we can do anything” highly unpaid burley’s says…”IT’s IT or ME”. Push, shove, beat….RIP,

SO….be advised.  Folks have scarred their dashes and messed up the copilot chair or had issues with the chair.

I’d venture to say….90% PLUS of all Res replacements go through a “removed” window.  NOW….also understand.  Monaco never cut a window opening “square”.  Go, use a little judicious force….there is usually a corner where they used a rubber mallet.  I had my Driver’s side…big sucker….repaired.  First thing the frame shop did was beat out the corner.  It works FINE….sliding.  An Ex Monaco supervisor ran a shop.  The rectangle windows are NOT AS BAD.

Just a synopsis of reading over 500 replacements….over 15 years….  The WINDOW method is more of a slam dunk….

Your RIG and no offense to your skill set….but we often learn more from what others messed up…than the successes ….

[jacwjames]

People seem to be reluctant to remove a window.  Over the ~16 years we've owned the coach I've had 5 windows out for one reason or another.  I did remove the drivers side window to fix the fogging.  Because of the size it was a little harder since I did it myself.  Mine only used the compression rubber type seal with a bead of caulk around the outside. 

I attempted to bring it in the front door, others had done it but they must have been a heck of a lot smarter/stronger then me.  I even took out the passenger seat and stripped the doors off, NOPE, wouldn't go. 

I took out the passenger side window above the dinette and slide the fridge in there.  EASY, should have done that the first time.

[Ron Shantos]

I am a little confused.  My Beaver Contessa has an EMERGENCY Window that OPENS (hinged via a track on the top) is large enough for the refrigerator to be brought in minus the box.  The window opens outward.  Why would I need to remove the window? See my attached photo of window. Just holding it open for you to see. It opens 90 degrees. The window is 47x47. This is how we removed the Dometic.

The 2x4 structure you see in the picture is a table I built over the desk in order to protect the deck and give a place/shelf to bring the refrigerator in. Would appreciate your input on this options

[birdshill123]

Very easy.  The window us hung from a rail. Just like an awning rail. At either end there is a very small Robertson screw

 Remove the rear screw and the windows will slide all the way and out. You might have to first sptay the rail with wd40. It takes 2 people. I don't know if you have valence over that window bit the blind and the valence have to come out. The fridge will be tight in that opening so it has to be 100%  level. Have fun

 

[Ron Shantos]

As birdshill123 posted earlier on Sept 21 on the emergency window.  Is there any danger of opening that Emergency Window too far and having it come out of the track?  I know that window weighs a lot.

Appreciate any input or experience or knowledge.

[Tom Cherry]

On 10/3/2024 at 1:28 PM, birdshill123 said:

Very easy.  The window us hung from a rail. Just like an awning rail. At either end there is a very small Robertson screw

 Remove the rear screw and the windows will slide all the way and out. You might have to first sptay the rail with wd40. It takes 2 people. I don't know if you have valence over that window bit the blind and the valence have to come out. The fridge will be tight in that opening so it has to be 100%  level. Have fun

 

WELL NOW.  That is clever. The ingenuity of our members always amazes me.  For ALL I know, my installer did that.  All I know...  It came out....It came in.  He did use my brackets and design for the retention and has been using that concept since then for all Res Refer installs.

Thanks.

[birdshill123]

Ron. You not open it very far. With 2 grunts you swing it out some and slide it to the rear. Removing the valence was harder than removing the window. It is not that heavy 

 

[Ron Shantos]

Bruce, Are you saying THAT IF YOU OPEN THE WINDOW SAY BEYOND 45 DEGREES ( straight out from the closed position) IT WILL COME OUT OF THE TRACK??  That is scary because in an emergency it would have to be opened at least 45 degress to get out.

Really appreciate your info & feedback.

[birdshill123]

Ron

 You are worried about nothing

 It is just easier to slide the window with it not being opened very far. You will be on a ladder and don't want to reach higher up. The window will not slide easily in a track  full of dirt.Relax. Have a good helper. If I can do it, anyone can do it.

 

[Ron Shantos]

I am CURRENTLY in the process of preparing to installing a FRIGIDAIRE Model FRQG1721AV 4 Door, NO ICE MAKER.  The DELIVERY of the Frigidaire is schedule for Tuesday Oct 8.

I have a Magnum ME2012 2000W inverter.  We do NOT dry camp. IS THE MAGNUM AN ISSUE to support the Frigidaire??   OR would the Samsung RF18 be a better choice?  

Appreciate any comments or feedback.

[birdshill123]

I would stay away from anything Samsung except cell phones. All of the appliances have problems. To make matters worse there is a lack of parts. Many independent techs will not work on those fridges

 Many rv"rs have replaced Samsungs within 5 years. That being said some users have no problems. Look up problems with Samsung fridges. Lots of lawsuits.

[rpasetto]

On 9/26/2023 at 12:40 PM, camelot said:

yes sir that is my question getting it in, probably have to take the windshield out. As for the operation of the frig when driving not on shore power Im guessing the gen set is the answer?

I removed the passenger seat and unbolted the check strap so the front door could be opened about 120 degrees.  The delivery guys removed the door and drawer front of the RF18, brought it in and put everything back together.  They waited after we plugged it in and checked to be sure all was working.   Gave them a nice tip.

Worse was taking out the old Dometic absorption reefer.

[camelot]

my frig works going down the road without gen set, had to plug into ice maker recepticle

[jacwjames]

23 hours ago, Ron Shantos said:

I am CURRENTLY in the process of preparing to installing a FRIGIDAIRE Model FRQG1721AV 4 Door, NO ICE MAKER.  The DELIVERY of the Frigidaire is schedule for Tuesday Oct 8.

I have a Magnum ME2012 2000W inverter.  We do NOT dry camp. IS THE MAGNUM AN ISSUE to support the Frigidaire??   OR would the Samsung RF18 be a better choice?  

Appreciate any comments or feedback.

Down load a manual for the fridge and see if there is any reference to not use with a MSW inverter (unless your inverter is a Pure Sine Wave)  Some manufacturers will have warnings. 

Is the Fridgidare an inverter type, were it has an inverter already built in??  Some of these are good with MSW inverters. 

Another option would be to install a smaller ~1000watt PSW inverter just for the fridge. 

I bought my Samsung RF18 fridge in 2017, actually bought it on clearance at Lowes $865, snapped it up in anticipation of needing one in the coach but also used it while building a house.  At that time there was a history of people installing Samsungs because they played well with MSW inverters.

I installed the Samsung in 2019 but didn't take many trips in 2020, finally started using it in 2021 and it has performed well.   Drops ice all day long in any temps.  Takes 2 hours to get cold in prep for a trip.

 

Edited October 7 by jacwjames

[Tom Cherry]

23 hours ago, Ron Shantos said:

I am CURRENTLY in the process of preparing to installing a FRIGIDAIRE Model FRQG1721AV 4 Door, NO ICE MAKER.  The DELIVERY of the Frigidaire is schedule for Tuesday Oct 8.

I have a Magnum ME2012 2000W inverter.  We do NOT dry camp. IS THE MAGNUM AN ISSUE to support the Frigidaire??   OR would the Samsung RF18 be a better choice?  

Appreciate any comments or feedback.

Wrote this and it GOT LOST.

Samsung uses an INVERTER Compressor.  If you google Inverter compressor refrigerator, there are LOTS of hits.  BUT, also, there is a "PARTS HOUSE" that has a How TO video and the list the Frigidaire as having one.  That is fairly recent.

NOW....there are some OLD posts out there (Googling) and Frigidaire...Circa 2013 told or sent an email to a person saying NO... That a MSW (Square Wave) would eventually damage the compressor.  Many of the TECHIE Solar guys back then posted horror stories of frying their units.  TRUTH or WHAT...It WAS on the Net.

FWIW...  Most of the conversions here have been to Samsung.  To the BEST of my recollection (so don't tell me to POST every comment), we have NEVER had a failure from a ME series Magnum.  Yes, a few have had issues...but there is NOT ANY BRAND of Refrigerator that has a 100% PERFECT NEVER FAILED record.  YES, the ratings on Samsung get some flack....but all the brands do.

SO....  MY OPINION and my Attorney says...  TO THE BEST OF MY RECOLLECTION...

Call Frigidaire. I downloaded the Owner's guide for your unit and did an extensive search (Adobe FIND) Inverter, sine, square, modified, etc.  NO HITS.  They (Frigidaire) do NOT seem to have any info in the manual.  

I would ask two questions.  Is this an Inverter Compressor?  Can you operate it on as Modified Square Wave Inverter or do they only recommend PURE SINE WAVE.  

SOME, and one of our founders did this.....  Install a Xantrex 1000 Watt inverter. It will be installed near the inverter.  You will need (Stock...can order Amazon) #2 cables.  The length will depend on the location. Measure the Magnum studs and get the right size.  Probably 3/8" (hole diameter)...the come in 5/16 and 3/8.  NOW, you will have to run a piece of 12/2 W Ground Romex from that area to the Refrigerator.  That will be the POWER.  You put an Outlet there....  BUT, you will need to remove the GFCI from the Xantrex and install a standard outlet.  Your HOME refrigerator does NOT have a GFCI. By CODE, it is a dedicated line...  SO no big deal. the Res Refer will always run on Battery.  That is the SAME as if you plugged into the Icemaker OUTLET... that outlet is on the Magnum.

That's the deal..  Let us know what Fridgedaire says...

[Ron Shantos]

Thank you for your response and information. Based on your information I have rescheduled delivery of the Frigidaire. I contacted Frigidaire and they confirmed in writing that this model does have the digital inverter compressor. They said they would email me the documentation on this but I haven’t received it yet. I will provide additional information when I receive the document.

Are you saying to use “the ice maker receptacle”? Do I still need to remove the GFCI from the Xantrex? If so are there any articles/write ups on this process? 
This forum is a wealth of knowledge and solutions! Thanks to everyone.

[Tom Cherry]

OK...lets recap.

Did Frigidaire TELL YOU THAT IT WAS OK TO USE A SQUARE WAVE INVERTER?  

My comments were that the Samsung Inverter Compressors were OK, PER SAMSUNG, to be used with a Square Wave Compressor.  From the YouTube Videos....the circuits and the compressor controller appear to be the same.....for any "GENERIC INVERTER" Compressor.  SO....by an ASSUMPTION that you must UNDERSTAND...

If the Inverter Compressors are OK...per Samsung for a Square Wave...and the Frigidaire uses an INVERTER compressor, one could ASSUME that it will be OK.  

BUT....Frigidaire SHOULD HAVE STATED THAT or SAID..  WE DO NOT KNOW.  THAT is what you need to KNOW.

NOW...  from the top.  When you install a Residential Refrigerator, you use the ICEMAKER OUTLET.  That is powered from the INVERTER.  SO, you have power to it when boondocking or driving or parked (like at a rest stop or when you visit an attraction).  The OTHER OUTLET....marked REFRIGERATOR is NOT connected to the Inverter. It is the 10 (Memory) REFRIGERATOR outlet in the main panel. It provides the 120 VAC input to a Gas/Electric Refrigerator.  IT ONLY WORKS when you have Shore or  Genny.

NOW....if you decide NOT to use the ICE MAKER Circuit....and install a RES REFER....you have to run power from where the Main Inverter is to the area BEHIND the Refrigerator....since you are NOT using the ICEMAKER receptacle.

The Xantrex Invter comes with a GFCI style residential outlet.  You remove the cover.  You remove the GFCI (it is connected with "wires" just like at home). You then put in a STANDARD OUTLET.  The reason the GFCI is there is that folks would use it in a TENT and run the risk of a short of shock. After you replace the GFCI, it is a DEDICATED circuit.  It is going directly to a "handy box" (you have to install a Box to HOUSE or hold the Receptacle).  Therefore, you are not plugging in a power tool and standing in water and using it.  

Hope this helps.