2005 Dynasty No Brake Lights

[ziaptrn]

Per request....Here are photos of the RRB and the offending relay outlined in red, and 2 schematic clips. Both are of Page 35 of the 2005 Monaco Wiring Download found on this site, one clip enlarged to show the detail in the area of interest (relay) and another clip of the lower right of the page identifying the title of the page. Also duly noted that "Tom C said that it was a relay!"    🙂

I hope that these help members and moderators in the future!

[MyronTruex]

Great job. Sure would appreciate some pictures of that area for future reference. '

Th J connectors mentioned previously are often referred to as cannon connectors. 

[Tom Cherry]

GREAT..  Thanks.

The RELAY, that you described, is one that was used in the early 2000's  In today's venacular, we mostly here, deal with Bosch 5 Pins.  Of COURSE there is a plethora of relays that Monaco had vendors use on board like the one in your pictue.

I chuckled...when I saw it...I had occasion to help FIX a 2004 or so Imperial. We were on a Caravan.  The GM of the Holiday Rambler dealership had owned it for a few months and sold it to a friend (Work associate). I had just BOUGHT a used 2004 Winnie Gasser and totally blown away. This was in the Spring is 2007... I didn't even know what DP stood for....  The Imperial got into a FUNK...it had leveling like I had never seen before and the owner had proceeded to get is so crooked that all the circuit breakers or such shut down.

The GM called his Senior Tech.  He handed the phone to me.  The tech told me EXACTLY which circuit breaker or button to push....and then he also had me telling the owner which buttons to "hit inside".  Talk about being over my head. BUT....we got it BACK to normal.  It would level and all was well.  BTW...the Owner was the GM of a large Chevy dealership...but SALES was his forte...not "techie".  I still kid him when we bump into each other....

BUT, the interior looked exactly like the one in the picture.  HOOKED.  I wannee boards and electronic stuff. Bottom line...  Where did you find the Relay?

Next up...for those following....if you look in your 2008, this is ARCHACIC... TOTALLY PRIMATIVE to the 20 or so boards in the Front and Rear.  Fortunately, we have experts.  @pwhittle and @Frank McElroy have the bench setup and the PROGRAMMING capability to take ANY of those 20 Boards....and can remove the CHIPS....mount NEW chips...then reprgram.

Intellitec made all the boards on your 2008....and they ain't on AMAZON.

Thanks for being persevering....glad it is fixed...as you BUDDY no doubt is...

[MonacoMan06]

Hello, I have a read this thread and have a similar problem with my 2006 Monaco Dynasty Platinum IV.  Both brake lights and turn signals quit working.  I have done a lot of testing and still can't find the problem.  The rear run box on this coach (discussed in this thread) is diffrerent than mine.  My electrical diagram book shows two different rear run boxes, one of which seems to be the one previously discussed

I have tested the two pressure switches and both seem to work.  I tested the voltage on the bolt in the lower left corner of PCB 2 located in the rear run box..  I tested the voltage and it was 14,1 VDC with the engine running and air pressure up.  PCB 2 is located  in the upper right hand corner of the rear run box.   The center cyclops break light works but not the standard brake lights.  I determind that the light assemblies used in my coach are standard Ford Pickup 4 wire lights.  I am confused by the wiring Schematic for the turn signals, Monaco Drawing Number 38010041.  That schematic shows the right and left brake lights connecting to Pin A of the tail light assembly.  The problem is that ther ford tail lights are a 4 pin wiring system.  The rear run box for my coach isMonaco Drawing Number 38031334.

I am wondering if Monaco used a 5 wire to 4 wire trailer converter to make the ford tail lights and trailer connetor plug work.  I have taken wiring looms apart and searched everywhere but cannot find a converter.  I installed one and one side of the turn signal and brake lights woked and had 12 + VDC but the other side didn't work and was than 6 VDC.  To get the lights working, I tied into the turn signals and added additional bulbs in the taillight housings to provide the turn signals.  I tied into the cyclops brake light that is working to provide the brake lights for the coach.  I now have both turn signals and brake lights on the coach, but have no brake lights for the Trailer plug,  

I would like to find the problem and return the coach to it's original state.  I tied to attach copies of the two wiring schematics referenced as well as pictures of the rear run box but was unable to get them attached,.  If anyone has suggestions as to how to fis this I would appreciate any suggestions.

Thank you, Jim

[waterskier_1]

31 minutes ago, MonacoMan06 said:

Hello, I have a read this thread and have a similar problem with my 2006 Monaco Dynasty Platinum IV.  Both brake lights and turn signals quit working.  I have done a lot of testing and still can't find the problem.  The rear run box on this coach (discussed in this thread) is diffrerent than mine.  My electrical diagram book shows two different rear run boxes, one of which seems to be the one previously discussed

I have tested the two pressure switches and both seem to work.  I tested the voltage on the bolt in the lower left corner of PCB 2 located in the rear run box..  I tested the voltage and it was 14,1 VDC with the engine running and air pressure up.  PCB 2 is located  in the upper right hand corner of the rear run box.   The center cyclops break light works but not the standard brake lights.  I determind that the light assemblies used in my coach are standard Ford Pickup 4 wire lights.  I am confused by the wiring Schematic for the turn signals, Monaco Drawing Number 38010041.  That schematic shows the right and left brake lights connecting to Pin A of the tail light assembly.  The problem is that ther ford tail lights are a 4 pin wiring system.  The rear run box for my coach isMonaco Drawing Number 38031334.

I am wondering if Monaco used a 5 wire to 4 wire trailer converter to make the ford tail lights and trailer connetor plug work.  I have taken wiring looms apart and searched everywhere but cannot find a converter.  I installed one and one side of the turn signal and brake lights woked and had 12 + VDC but the other side didn't work and was than 6 VDC.  To get the lights working, I tied into the turn signals and added additional bulbs in the taillight housings to provide the turn signals.  I tied into the cyclops brake light that is working to provide the brake lights for the coach.  I now have both turn signals and brake lights on the coach, but have no brake lights for the Trailer plug,  

I would like to find the problem and return the coach to it's original state.  I tied to attach copies of the two wiring schematics referenced as well as pictures of the rear run box but was unable to get them attached,.  If anyone has suggestions as to how to fis this I would appreciate any suggestions.

Thank you, Jim

Jim, I will try and help.  Your coach, as far as the chassis wiring, looks the same as my 2005 Exec.  My first question is you mention that your tail lights are "standard Ford 4-wire" assemblies.  Mine are not.  Do your Ford assemblies use the same filament of the same bulb(s) for both the brake light and the turn signal?  Mine have a separate bulb (and filament) for the Turn signal, and a separate bulb(s) and filaments for the brake lights.  In fact, my rear turn signals are amber.  This is by design.  From the schematic (wiring diagram # 38010041) it shows that the tuns signals would be on a separate pin and the brakes on a separate pin A, as you posted.  It sounds like the wiring and the tail light assemblies are not compatible with the diagram, and each other.  

On a side note, I had to build (you can purchase, as I think you posted) a trailer light converter to go between 4-wire and 5-wire systems.  My coach was wired for 5-wire to the 7-pin trailer connector.  The PO of my coach had a towed that used separate brake and turn filaments, and apparently wired the trailer connector for that purpose.  Since my towed, and most trailers, use the same filament for brake and turn, I made a "converter" to  put the brake and turn on the same filament.  Many told me this was not necessary, for the trailer socket,  but I find no way the schematic or actual wiring combined the brake and turn.  

The first step to solving your issue is to determine if you have a tail light assembly that supports separate brake and turn signals.  You seem confident that what you have does not.  If this is true, you have a nonconforming (to the wiring diagram and likely the actual coach wiring).  Is it possible that someone replaced the tail light assemblies?  Is it possible that some of the bulbs in the tail light assemblies are wired together, and should be separate, such that the turn is on one bulb and the brake is on another?  I'm not discussing the possible second, dimmer, filament for marker (tail) lights.  

-Rick N.

[MonacoMan06]

Thanks for your reply Rick N.  My coach has a 4 wire tail light/brakelight assembly.  In that system one wire is ground, 1 wire is for tail lights and the turn signals act as both the brake light and the turn signal.  There is not a separate bulb for the brake light.  In a 5 wire system, 1 wire is for ground, 1 for tail lights, 1 wire for right turn, 1 wire for left turn and 1 wire for bake lights.  The Monaco Drawing Number 38010041 appears to show a five wire system that has a separte bake light which sounds like your coach.  It does not show anything as far as converting a five wire system to the 4 wire system used on my coach.  I have a friend that has a Holiday Rambler with a similar system as mine and it has a brake light converter converting the five wire system to a 4 wire, system.  It is mounted on the top of the frame rail and is clearly visible.  We have searched everywhere and cannot locate any converter.

One additional fact that I failed to mention is that all three of the check lights on PCB 2 are working when the engine running and the brake pedal depressed.

[waterskier_1]

24 minutes ago, MonacoMan06 said:

Thanks for your reply Rick N.  My coach has a 4 wire tail light/brakelight assembly.  In that system one wire is ground, 1 wire is for tail lights and the turn signals act as both the brake light and the turn signal.  There is not a separate bulb for the brake light.  In a 5 wire system, 1 wire is for ground, 1 for tail lights, 1 wire for right turn, 1 wire for left turn and 1 wire for bake lights.  The Monaco Drawing Number 38010041 appears to show a five wire system that has a separte bake light which sounds like your coach.  It does not show anything as far as converting a five wire system to the 4 wire system used on my coach.  I have a friend that has a Holiday Rambler with a similar system as mine and it has a brake light converter converting the five wire system to a 4 wire, system.  It is mounted on the top of the frame rail and is clearly visible.  We have searched everywhere and cannot locate any converter.

One additional fact that I failed to mention is that all three of the check lights on PCB 2 are working when the engine running and the brake pedal depressed.

It sounds like you should cut your losses (time-wise) and purchase a 5-wire to 4-wire converter.  Most today are solid state, and will likely work fine in your coach.  I chose to use relays when I designed mine for the trailer light circuit because the solid-state types have a voltage drop of around 0.5 volts, and I didn't want this for my toad since I was running 30+ feet of wire from the coach to the tail end of my Grand Cherokee.  

Since the PO had 5-wire system for his toad (a Honda, I think), and I didn't discover the issue until after I bought the coach (my test of turn signal lights passed, so that confirmed the circuit integrity, and didn't check for brake lights.  So, I can not confirm that my coach did or didn't come with a converter, but it would have only been used for towed with 4-wire.  Possibly the PO removed it when/if he rewired the trailer connector.

  -Rick N. 

[MonacoMan06]

Thanks Rick N.  As I stated in my initial post, I did try installing a 5 wire to 4 wire converter in my coach.  One side worked fine and carried 12+ VDC.  The other side did not work and was reading less than 6 volts.  I assumed that was because there was a converter already in the coach and that it was faulty.

I tied into the turn signal wires and installed new bulbs and sockets in the light housings so that I have turn signals now.  The original brake lights and tail lights are working as they did originally,  Turn signals work on the toad but I don't have brake lights on the toad.

[waterskier_1]

18 hours ago, MonacoMan06 said:

Thanks Rick N.  As I stated in my initial post, I did try installing a 5 wire to 4 wire converter in my coach.  One side worked fine and carried 12+ VDC.  The other side did not work and was reading less than 6 volts.  I assumed that was because there was a converter already in the coach and that it was faulty.

I tied into the turn signal wires and installed new bulbs and sockets in the light housings so that I have turn signals now.  The original brake lights and tail lights are working as they did originally,  Turn signals work on the toad but I don't have brake lights on the toad.

Ok, understand that you tried installing a 5-wire to 4-wire converter.  Can you provide me which converter you tried?  I'm not sure if there might have been a wiring error, or a faulty inverter.  Even if you did already have a converter installed, if the wires you used from the coach to the converter had the brake signal on one wire, and the turns each on their respective wire, the converter should have worked.  If you can give me a mfg and model/part number that I can look up online I can confirm that you wired it correctly, and maybe troubleshoot.  Right now, I'm not sure what "carried 12+ VDC" and "less than 6 volts" relates to the converter wiring.

  -Rick N.

[MonacoMan06]

Hi Rick

I took the converter back out when I could not get it to work.  I am on the road until September and the converter is home.  It is apparent that Monaco provided drawing 38010041 in error for my coach with a four wire system.  I am going to see if I can find the turn signal drawing for a 4 wire system and see what that shows.  I am wondering if the conversion from a five wire system to a four wire system was done in the circuit board rather than using a converter.  That will be my next project to try to gigure that out.  

I really appreciate your help and will send you the converter information when I get home.  Thank you!