Electrical nightmare

[birdshill123]

I am having 12 volt issues with my radio, dash monitor and the hvac system. It has been an ongoing problem. About 18 momnhs ago my Sony monitor dies. I boughty a new monitor and the adapters from Tim @ RVcams. Worked great for about 6 months. Both Tom and Frank helpd me. At first it was the J connector in the FRB. I cleaned it up and all was well. But before we left Mexico in the spring the radio and the new monitor would not work. I have been having health issues and at 81 I am not as sharp as I once.  I opened up the dash and gave it about 1/2 day. Gave up. Yesterday I opened up the dash and removed the HVAC panel and radio. I looked at the wiring schematics. I cannot find the original connections from the old Sony monitor. I must have connected them up originally as everything worked. But I also must have disconnected them in the spring. This morning I had the monitor turned on . I can get into the menu. But no picture as the proper wires are not connected.  I have connected Cam 1 as RV cams instructed. I cannot find the Monaco / Sony wires. The radio was working up to today but suddenly quit. I checked all the fuses in both the FRB and RRB. Last week I changed the ignition switch as it was acting up. I cleaned all my batteries and load tested. Used a hydrometer as well. 2 of the 8 are border line but OK for now .Even the gen start switch mounted to the hvac panel is dead. I was going to connect the radio and monitor to a known 12  volt source. There is one #14 red wire that showed voltage this morning. Now that is dead as well I tested it with a multimeter and it shows 1.7 volts!. I checked the relays in the RRB and all are good. Fairly new. There are no mobile techs or shops that  understand Monaco's or any other high end unit in Manitoba. Closest is 500 miles and a border away. The only thing I have not tried is to crawl under and check all the grounds. All the lights, gauges, step, etc. work. Inverter will run the fridge. I could run a new 12 volt wire to the dash but that is not only difficult it does not fix what is causing the problem. Any help appreciated. The rear monitor  connects to all the cameras and the Alladin screens.

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, birdshill123 said:

I am having 12 volt issues with my radio, dash monitor and the hvac system. It has been an ongoing problem. About 18 momnhs ago my Sony monitor dies. I boughty a new monitor and the adapters from Tim @ RVcams. Worked great for about 6 months. Both Tom and Frank helpd me. At first it was the J connector in the FRB. I cleaned it up and all was well. But before we left Mexico in the spring the radio and the new monitor would not work. I have been having health issues and at 81 I am not as sharp as I once.  I opened up the dash and gave it about 1/2 day. Gave up. Yesterday I opened up the dash and removed the HVAC panel and radio. I looked at the wiring schematics. I cannot find the original connections from the old Sony monitor. I must have connected them up originally as everything worked. But I also must have disconnected them in the spring. This morning I had the monitor turned on . I can get into the menu. But no picture as the proper wires are not connected.  I have connected Cam 1 as RV cams instructed. I cannot find the Monaco / Sony wires. The radio was working up to today but suddenly quit. I checked all the fuses in both the FRB and RRB. Last week I changed the ignition switch as it was acting up. I cleaned all my batteries and load tested. Used a hydrometer as well. 2 of the 8 are border line but OK for now .Even the gen start switch mounted to the hvac panel is dead. I was going to connect the radio and monitor to a known 12  volt source. There is one #14 red wire that showed voltage this morning. Now that is dead as well I tested it with a multimeter and it shows 1.7 volts!. I checked the relays in the RRB and all are good. Fairly new. There are no mobile techs or shops that  understand Monaco's or any other high end unit in Manitoba. Closest is 500 miles and a border away. The only thing I have not tried is to crawl under and check all the grounds. All the lights, gauges, step, etc. work. Inverter will run the fridge. I could run a new 12 volt wire to the dash but that is not only difficult it does not fix what is causing the problem. Any help appreciated. The rear monitor  connects to all the cameras and the Alladin screens.

There are 2 grounds in the back, under or behind the battery box.  Remove the nuts and clean the paint on the frame around the welded stud.  Then use steel wool and clean the rings or the cable ends.  Tighten back up.  I spray with battery terminal corrosion “paint”.

Next.  Up front, there is ONE ground from the generator cranking studs to ground….and one positive to the front. FWIW.  These cables are #2 Gauge.  We have determined that Monaco GOOFED.  They should have been 2/0 (00). Did an extensive Cable Voltage Drop workup.  In addition, a member took the recommendation and replaced his with 2/0 (00).  CRANKS as it should….so we KNOW that works….theory and calculations said so.  Replacement made all the difference….best ever as lomg as he has owned coach.  That WILL NOT fix the gauges and such….but it WILL allow you to reliably crank the genny….put on a TO DO list.  There is a topic on this.

NEXT…there is at least 2 or maybe 3 ground cables up front.  Frank is the expert. One may be a shared one.  The HWH probably has a dedicated ground.  Trace it.  There may be another cable or so on that stud.  Clean as before. Then, either on the prints or start looking up front.  Chase the large or maybe between your thumb and first finger sized cables.  Will be black.  Find their studs.  They MAY have a bolt and not a stud, but drilled and tapped into frame.

A Finally, there is a large GROUND BUSS in the dash area….may have a cable the size of your little finger going to it.  Chase that.  Folks have run new grounds but Frank, I think, has some “electronic” reasons why that can also cause issues.  So, locate the ground cables coming into the dash area and then keep tracing until you find a connection or whatever.

NOW….voltage testing…and this is generic….can be tricky.  Folks don’t understand that you REALLY have to use s sharp probe and break the paint on the frame or whatever.  I’d locate a BOLTED cable or find a bolt that you can remove without doing any damage.  Maybe a solenoid bolted to a frame.  Loosen up one bolt and put a piece of at least #14 wire and run it inside and use it with an alligator clip for your meter.  I can’t count the number of times not having a good meter ground has given false info and drove folks crazy.

Frank will probably chime in..my input is generic….but it has to be done.. 

[birdshill123]

I did see the ground bus under the dash. I was using a ground from the ignition switch. I tried to follow that red #14 under the dash but it disappeared into a loom made of heavy black "stuff". When vehicles were not so complex a bad ground would be  my guess.

 

[birdshill123]

Well,I am making  some progress. The radio has a receptacle on the back for all the wiring. One wire was slightly pulled out and it has blown the fuse. Working ok. But the back up monitor still  has problems. I have not found the left and right turn signal wires. I should be able to see them under the dash access panel. But no luck.

 There is a 12 or 14 g red wire that is dead. It powers the dash heat_ac and I cannot find a fuse. Not in either front or rear run bay.  The only place I did not look was in the closet with the multiplex. Thanks.

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, birdshill123 said:

Well,I am making  some progress. The radio has a receptacle on the back for all the wiring. One wire was slightly pulled out and it has blown the fuse. Working ok. But the back up monitor still  has problems. I have not found the left and right turn signal wires. I should be able to see them under the dash access panel. But no luck.

 There is a 12 or 14 g red wire that is dead. It powers the dash heat_ac and I cannot find a fuse. Not in either front or rear run bay.  The only place I did not look was in the closet with the multiplex. Thanks.

OK....it is or WAS TIME to start reading the prints.  Here is the HVAC for your Dynasty.  If you have NOT downloaded the prints...that is a MUST...

From the TOP.  Power comes in from the FRB. There is an HVACCB 30 Amp "FUSE".  It MAY be a resettable Circuit Breaker of a BIG Fuse.  There is where you look and that is the label. That is a 10 Gauge though....a BIG PUPPY. First, locate it.  CHECK for power.  Remember to use an alligator clip lead on your meter for a good ground.

NOW...about those 14 Gauge Wires.  The RED ones are the IN and OUT of the Fan Motor Resistor Pack. I can NOT tell what is he POWER lead for the Resistor pack.  ONE of the 4 wires....is the POWER.  The other three are going to the motor.  The way it works, if you are NOT familiar.  Power come in on ONE wire.  Then there are TWO other wires with resistors in series.  SO, when the fan is on the HIGH speed....the POWER wire....gives POWER to the MOTOR.  This is essentially a PURE 12 VDC.  Go to Medium... Then ONE of the wires has a resistor...so the motor is getting a lower voltage.  LOW is the final wire.  It's resistor and the Medium Resistor are in SERIES...so you add the resistance of the Medium to the resistance of the LOW...and you get a reduced voltage.  That's how it work.  You need to get POWER to the #10 Wire and start there....otherwise, this is a wild goose chase.

OK...RADIO.  This is PROBABLY or COULD BE a Magnadyne issue.  Monaco made up Pigtails or had connectors for the Camera and the RADIO.  ON THAT I KNOW I am right.  Sometimes those pigtails (mine is a 2009) were NOT the best quality. The terminating PIN on either the Radio (or Camera System) side for POWER was not pushed in far enough.  Then when the pigtails were PAIRED, you had a Faulty or a high resistance connection.  That COULD have been on the Monaco Side...as well.

In my case, I had issues with my Camera.  The pigtails were different...but the same brand and type. What happened on my Camera...the positive pin on the CAMERA side was NOT properly terminated or PUSHED in far enough into the plastic.  SO, there was a BAD connection.  That high resistance connection smoked some capacitors on the Camera's PCB or Power Supply board.  The vendor replaced it or rebuilt it at NOT charge. 

SO, carefully inspect both sides of each PIN or on the PLUGS when mated.  Take a small screwdriver or a probe and push in the terminal (you can easily see them from the back.  Make sure the pins on each connector (the big Male and Female) have their PINS PUSHED in and seated.  That will solve that.

Turnsignals...  ON YOUR OWN.

BUT, I can tell you, that if you are NOT FOLLOWING THE PRINTS>>>>you are flying blind. Here is the link to the PROPER FILE...

What you want to do is read the file note.  You want to CLICK on the link on the first page.  That is the one under..."For a COMPLETE SET" text.

Download that.  Put it in a NEW FOLDER...2008 Dynasty Wiring Diagrams.  THEN when it downloads...it will be about 200 files.  FIND the   - Dynasty Print Index File.  Rename it 2008 AAA Dynasty Print Index File.

THEN resort the files.  That INDEX file is your BIBLE.  It tells you all you want to know.  It will be at the TOP.

NOW...if you are in the entire file with 200 files or prints...you can use WINDOWS search. I found the FRONT HVAC file by searching.  I used HVAC and FRONT came up.  I could have USED FRONT>..

That's how you navigate...

Good luck.

38010837 (Schematic, Dash, HVAC).pdf

[birdshill123]

The radio os working

 The back up monitor/alladin works great. But the Hvac is problematic

 There is no power to the  control panel. No fan. There is supposed to be a 30 amp cb in the front. Nothing. I tested every fuse and cb

 I am stumped

 

 

[Tom Cherry]

12 minutes ago, birdshill123 said:

The radio os working

 The back up monitor/alladin works great. But the Hvac is problematic

 There is no power to the  control panel. No fan. There is supposed to be a 30 amp cb in the front. Nothing. I tested every fuse and cb

 I am stumped

 

 

YES... Stumped is BAD..  BUT you need to use the prints....  I don't know a LOT about the Dynasty...but Frank taught me enough to muddle through...

First ...  Look at the 38040159.  BLOW IT UP.  Look at BOARD #10.  Lower RIGHT CORNER.  That is the 30 AMP Circuit Breaker or maybe a FUSE.  I can't tell, but it is there...

NOW, go to 38031327.  BLow it UP.  Look at the BOTTOM of PCB#10 (aka Board #10).  There it is again.  This print shows and has it marked...  10GA White to J2-7 Heater Control PNL (Panel).  

SO...first.  If there is NOTHING coming out on that 10 Guage AND IT IS WHITE...wire on the 1327 print...the CB or the FUSE is BAD.  You have TO HAVE POWER out...

You then must find the INCOMING #10 Gauge WIRE (the J2-7 ...and it HAS to have power.

THEN...once you do that....go from there.  Do NOT FORGET that NOTHING is gonna WORK until you check the Fuse/CB on Board #10.  Again, the Red #14 should not have power...NOTHING up front on the entire HVAC system should have power on the control....or maybe there is ANOTHER power supply, but the print that I posted yesterday says ONLY the #10 Gauge WIRE from the 30 Amp "DEVICE" (Fuse or CB)...that is the only power.

That's it...  Now find board 10 and test and go from there...

Good Luck...

38040159 (Detail, Run Box, Front).pdf 38050052 (Detail, Labels, Front Run Box).pdf 38031327 (Schematic, Front Run Box).pdf

[birdshill123]

Tom. I don't care what they say you are a genius! I never noticed that cb as it is installed on the inside of board 10

Looking closer it is marked ignitio accesory switch. I can only see one wire and it is yellow. The cb is slightly corroded.  The Dynasties  are famous for water intrusion

 I will pick up a new one and clean everything. I still have to get under and clean up all the grounds and hot junctions. Have not decided if I want to get new batteries. You have saved the day. I am a worry wort and have not slept well for 3 days . Muchas Gracias.

[birdshill123]

Since my last post I discovered there was still a problem. The monitor stopped working. I checked everything but had not replaced the 30 amp circuit breaker. I think it was intermittent.  Replaced it and so far all is good. That breaker is marked ignition acc. fuse but once the new one was installed the HVAC is working. Under the dash there are 2 white plastic junction  connectors. One is #34 and it connects to the radio; speakers  power and more. The other connector is marked 35A and is only 3 wires: green  with red,black, and white with red. I cannot find it  in the schematics.  According to RV cams they  should connect to the monitor. The black is ground. The green connects to a blue on the monitor and is marked as a trigger wire. The white is supposed to be hot but is dead. These are 18 g wires. I temporarily connected power to the monitor and it works. If I cannot find where that white wire is fused could I just connect to the power from #34. This is a yellow hot wire that feeds the radio. I have checked every fuse in both front and rear run bays. All are good. Thanks.

 ,

 

 

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, birdshill123 said:

Since my last post I discovered there was still a problem. The monitor stopped working. I checked everything but had not replaced the 30 amp circuit breaker. I think it was intermittent.  Replaced it and so far all is good. That breaker is marked ignition acc. fuse but once the new one was installed the HVAC is working. Under the dash there are 2 white plastic junction  connectors. One is #34 and it connects to the radio; speakers  power and more. The other connector is marked 35A and is only 3 wires: green  with red,black, and white with red. I cannot find it  in the schematics.  According to RV cams they  should connect to the monitor. The black is ground. The green connects to a blue on the monitor and is marked as a trigger wire. The white is supposed to be hot but is dead. These are 18 g wires. I temporarily connected power to the monitor and it works. If I cannot find where that white wire is fused could I just connect to the power from #34. This is a yellow hot wire that feeds the radio. I have checked every fuse in both front and rear run bays. All are good. Thanks.

 ,

 

 

OK….officially….the “STAFF’s ANSWER…..STOP.  Do NOT rewire or “see if this works”.  
 

You now need to either see a tech or use (and learning is interesting) the prints.  There are many prints inside the 200 files.  Way too many for me to keep checking and spending time on. There are prints with all the connector numbers….and where each individual wire, on either side goes….then you keep following those wires to another connector or to a board up front.

You are making progress, but if you, even with some logic and confidence, don’t know where what goes….then rewiring is not advised…   If you KNEW what the fuse value is for the Monitor??  Then, yes…find a point.  BUT, how do you find a point if you don’t know how it is fused.  You also have to run an inline fuse.  The beat goes on.  IF you find an IGNITION source….and it has some extra capacity….then you MIGHT run a smaller fused line to the monitor.  So, your call…your motor home and you know what you need prior to “rewiring”.  But that has to come from the prints….catch 22…

Researching this on paper is time consuming….frustrating.  I’m tied up and only do this as the first step.  You’re there….another Dynasty owner might chime in.  This is really at the “PM and take offline” point….
 

[Tom Cherry]

2 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

Since my last post I discovered there was still a problem. The monitor stopped working. I checked everything but had not replaced the 30 amp circuit breaker. I think it was intermittent.  Replaced it and so far all is good. That breaker is marked ignition acc. fuse but once the new one was installed the HVAC is working. Under the dash there are 2 white plastic junction  connectors. One is #34 and it connects to the radio; speakers  power and more. The other connector is marked 35A and is only 3 wires: green  with red,black, and white with red. I cannot find it  in the schematics.  According to RV cams they  should connect to the monitor. The black is ground. The green connects to a blue on the monitor and is marked as a trigger wire. The white is supposed to be hot but is dead. These are 18 g wires. I temporarily connected power to the monitor and it works. If I cannot find where that white wire is fused could I just connect to the power from #34. This is a yellow hot wire that feeds the radio. I have checked every fuse in both front and rear run bays. All are good. Thanks.

 ,

 

 

OK...needed to clear my head before crawling under the house and doing a dreaded rewring job.  Please use the prints that you have.  Look on the 38040159 Print (attached to a previous post). 

Blow it up. 

Start READING the FUSE LABELS.  That is all I did.  There are THREE possibilities 

Board 9 - F 11

Board 10 - F10

Board 13 - F 6

The smart MONEY is on B13 and F6.  BINGO should be your CRY...  That says MONITOR.  it is ALSO a 7.5 A which is a dead giveaway...

There are way too many fuses and CB in this monster.  Pulling each one is fool hardy.  Even Probing is hit or miss.  Look at the PRINTS.  Blow them UP.  Scroll down each label.  

Let us know...but in the future, please remember that the correct trouble shooting is, in addition probing and talking to a vendors...  CHECK and FIND the FUSE/CB on the Monaco Prints...

Good Luc...

[birdshill123]

Thanks Tom. Board 13 is different in my unit and on 3803127. That board shows: block heat,step cover,mirage dock lights and 2 spares. Regardless all the fuses you mentioned are good are good.  All good. I carefully visually scanned my  entire FRB. Nowhere does it show monitor How can I find diagram that shows  connector35A? One wire on that  connector is an unused switched hot . It must have been connected to the old Sony. I connected it to the monitor and voila everything works. It probably is fused but I can easily add a 7.5 fuse.

[Tom Cherry]

3 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

Thanks Tom. Board 13 is different in my unit and on 3803127. That board shows: block heat,step cover,mirage dock lights and 2 spares. Regardless all the fuses you mentioned are good are good.  All good. I carefully visually scanned my  entire FRB. Nowhere does it show monitor How can I find diagram that shows  connector35A? One wire on that  connector is an unused switched hot . It must have been connected to the old Sony. I connected it to the monitor and voila everything works. It probably is fused but I can easily add a 7.5 fuse.

Only way…go through the prints.  That is supposed to be what your boards look like.  Prints have been known to be wrong…

Have you used a good LED flashlight and even a hand lens?  The labels are there.  
 

I recommend you PM @Frank McElroy.  He has a 2008 and knows MORE about it than the assemblers and designers.  Maybe he can find where his monitor is fed?  But do your once over…twice over of your boards….there is one in there…or else it is combined with another.

[birdshill123]

Thanks Tom.

[Frank McElroy]

13 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

Thanks Tom. Board 13 is different in my unit and on 3803127. That board shows: block heat,step cover,mirage dock lights and 2 spares. Regardless all the fuses you mentioned are good are good.  All good. I carefully visually scanned my  entire FRB. Nowhere does it show monitor How can I find diagram that shows  connector35A? One wire on that  connector is an unused switched hot . It must have been connected to the old Sony. I connected it to the monitor and voila everything works. It probably is fused but I can easily add a 7.5 fuse.

Here are screenshots of connectors M35A and the referenced M100.  These are in the schematics.

[birdshill123]

Thanks Frank. I am enclosing a picture of that. M35A. The white 14  is connected to a 18 g black. It is a ground. The 14  g red is connected to an an 18g white. I have not hooked it up. I will test see if it is for the backup. The 14 g green is connected to the18 g green. It is 12 volts hot. When I hook it to the voyager everything works. 

[Frank McElroy]

With the radio and monitor power loss/intermittent, I'd check the large multi pin round J connectors on the side wall of the FRB.  In cases where fuses are good but power isn't making it up to the dash, corrosion inside one of the J connectors are often the issue.

[birdshill123]

Thanks Frank

[birdshill123]

I think the problem has been solved. The intermittent power to the radio had a bad connector on the back of the radio. It is a small .5 inch square terminal that did not make good contact. I made a new one. The monitor to replace the Sony monitor came with a custom plug to adapt the old Sony wiring to the new monitor. It is made of a stiff black plastic. I was not fully connecting them together.  It took lots of force. Tom and Frank gave good advice on the J connectors. I sprayed  them with contact cleaner.  The monitor came with wiring that did not apply to the Dynasty. I was looking for side camera wires. Thay are not needed as somehow that is done by the Alladin and the connector box in the upper dash access. Thank again to Frank and Tom.

 I