Need to PROBABLY(?) replace a failed RV2012 Trace Inverter... Recommendations?

[jacwjames]

Currently having trouble with my RV2012 Trace inverter

What is a good option to replace it. 

Followup to this topic....

 

Edited September 4 by Tom Cherry
Edited to provide background....could have been merged into original.

[Tom Cherry]

Edited the title and did not merge as it was on the fine line....between continuation of an existing and current topic....BUT, replacement will be more general.

My comment... 

IT DEPENDS.

If you are going to convert or consider going to Lithiums...then I would NOT recommend the Magnum.  I am one of the MAJOR proponents of them and also help with most every problem with them.  

BUT, if you are going to stay with AGM's or Flooded...then my choice...HANDS DOWN would be the Magnum MS2012.  NOW....You DO, I think, actually KNOW that you have the DUAL IN and DUAL OUT sub panel.  THAT then changes things....

You need a DUAL IN DUAL OUT Magnum MS series.  If it were ME...I would upgrade to the MS2812.  That provides, at very little cost, MORE inverting Capacity.  That is what was standard on all 2005 and up Dynasty.  YOUR SubPanel is IDENTICAL to the one used today.  It has NOT BEEN CHANGED.  You provided me with the print and we went over it.  I took the Dynasty Drawing...  SAME DEAL...so what, from a POWER standpoint...worked in 2002....works and was in use in all Dynasty (save the ALL ELECTRIC...I think) and UP until Navistar sold to REV.  TRIED and PROVEN. ROBUST as all get out.  BUT, IMHO....NOT designed nor would I use for LIthiums.

NOW....that then also raises the RED FLAG.  You MUST, or I would...as the SubPanel is great....the NEED to FIND A DUAL IN and DUAL OUT (Dual or quad...if you prefer) 30 Amp Breakers...  The MS2812 or MS2012 in the DUAL IN DUAL OUT package is a DROP IN...

As to the REMOTE.  I am SIMPLE.  I don't need the Battery Monitoring Kit (BMK).  I don't recall if you have a Shunt system or not....so if you do not plan on using a BMK, then purchase the Standard RC-ME or ME-RC....otherwise the advanced one...

That's my take....

LITHIUMS in your future...  The Victron is what Frank McElroy and I have BOTH pondered....if our Magnum's die...and they WILL.....but getting 22 years out of an electronic device...in today's environment...if phenomonal.  SO, the decision for me...and I assume Frank.  DO I WANT TO INVEST in the Lithiums? 

We are getting in excess of 8 or so years out of our Trojan T-105's.  SO, if we pay $800 for 4 of them (Frank had 8)....so in MY case..  $800 divided by 8 is $100 per year. 

THAT is the BAR or the REAL COST.  Now....  Do the math.  How much MORE will one spend for Lithiums.  How much LONGER will they last or are supposed to last PAST the Flooded?  What is the RISK of damaging them due to poor or a poor quality or inadequate charging system.  IF I WERE TO SPRING for LITHIUMS...I would get the BEST Victron....and then go from there.

You are in a UNIQUE situation.  Spend $100 per year for batteries....for X number of years....if you put in the Magnum and I KNOW that you maintain them.  

SO, what is the COST of a Victron comparable to the Magnum DUAL IN DUAL OUT MS2012 or MS2812.  Victron DOES make a 3000 Watt DUAL IN DUAL OUT....or so I have been told.  THAT would be the choice.  SO...  How does that compare to the Magnum?  Don't KNOW.

THEN....What is the USEFUL or expected SERVICE LIFE of the Lithiums.  8 YEARS is NOT unusual for Trojans.  THEN do the math.  If you get 12 years....  How much were FOUR.  Prices I have seen are that the 12 VDC 100 AH Lithiums...the QUALITY ONES...comparable to Trojan is say $500.  OK...FOUR TIMES $500.  That is $2,000.

NOW assume they last 12 years.  That is $167 PER YEAR.  That is 2/3's MORE PER YEAR than the Flooded.  PROBABLY CAN NOT talk myself into almost DOUBLING my annual battery cost.  BUT, that is ME...

Hope this helps....

The posts will, as usual...be interesting and hopefully, factual... L:OL...  Lithiums are almost like Ford V Chevy trucks...  

[jacwjames]

@Tom Cherry

Tom, I did do a search on replacement of a Trace Inverter and there are hundreds of posts but a lot do center on replacement in order to go with lithium.

I've already did the cost benefit analysis of lithium batteries but  for us it doesn't make sense.  We don't boondock for long periods of time, doubt we ever will.  We get by just fine on a bank of golf cart batteries and my last two sets we averaged +9 years.  My current set is only 38 months old, not sure what consequences of overcharging and boiling out most of the water will be.  What is odd is that even this AM without charger on the batteries were 13.23 volts. 

Thanks for the response.  I'd lean toward a Magnum inverter also if I ultimately have to change.

[96 EVO]

Your call.

If I needed to replace today, it would definitely be Lithium capable!

[jacwjames]

@Tom Cherry

My current inverter has a dual in/out feed.  The main service panel has two breakers that feed the inverter and in turn there is a separate inverter subpanel that is powered by the inverter.

I'm not familiar with the Magnum series of inverters.  How are they wired and how difficult would it be to adapt to my current wiring scheme. 

[Tom Cherry]

14 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

@Tom Cherry

My current inverter has a dual in/out feed.  The main service panel has two breakers that feed the inverter and in turn there is a separate inverter subpanel that is powered by the inverter.

I'm not familiar with the Magnum series of inverters.  How are they wired and how difficult would it be to adapt to my current wiring scheme. 

They are the SAME.  You can order the MS2012 or the MS2812 in several "Flavors".  The MOST COMMON is a SINGLE IN and DUAL OUT.  That has a 30 Amp INLET CB  and TWO 20 Amp OUT or Line 1 and Line 2.  These are the PIN style breakers.

When you order the DUAL IN and DUAL OUT....there are NO Pin style CB's

Here is the print.  Basically, it is wired just like yours.  You have TWO 30 A CB on the main panel.  Your LINE1 Black and Line 2 Black go to the HOT Line1 and Line 2 IN.  Then the HOT OUT Line 1 and Line 2 go to the 30 Amp Breakers in your Sub Panel.

You can download the manual...and it goes into the details.  The manual is written for a variety of electrical configurations.  However, you order the TYPE of system you have or the specific "submodel" number.  The lower in's like the Camelot are the THREE pin breaker types.  The Dynasty and up are the Dual In Dual Out.  Magnum will give you the correct PN and ordering details for the one you select....a DUAL IN DUAL OUT in which ever size (2,000 or 2,800 watt) you choose.  There is NO difference in the PASS THROUGH power.  That is 3,750 Watts (based on the 30 AMP breaker.  However, you get MORE inverting watts with the 2,800.  It is STRICTLY a matter of what Inverting Capacity you require.  In 2008, which is what I use as my "standard", if a RES REFER was installed, then it was a 2,800 Watt inverter.  If the Norcold was used, it was a 2,000 watt.  PERSONALLY....since you have the Subpanel, I would go with the 2,800...  You get MORE diversity and you can "spread or balance" your load better.

That's it.  You have to make the call as to the SHUNT (I think you have one) or Battery Monitoring Kit and that requires the ACR or whatever Remote.  The standard remote will work with either...but it not, I think, compatible if you later upgrade to the Magnum BMK.

The AGS will be the AGS-N.  FORTUNATELY....the wiring on your own AGS is very similar to the Magnum.  There are about 5 wires on the Genny Harness.  They are the SAME...you just have to read the prints and do the "pings or pin out".  Magnum will help you do that over the phone.  It is really simple.  They had me test my defective AGS and told me WHICH pins to measure voltage on and which to jumper.  The Onan uses a NEGATIVE START system...so you just "copy" that.

That's the drill.

2008 Dynasty Magnum Dual IN Dual OUT 38010102.pdf